Saturday, May 27, 2017

You're Killing Me Marvin!

Yet again, Peep has ferreted out an article here, about how we should feel pity for the people who oppress others, and that they are really wounded souls that need to be coddled until they find their way home. Spiritually is my guess. He offers up the fact that many oppressors commit suicide as evidence that there is that last spark of humanity inside and that they realize they have lost touch with it and can not bear to live on knowing what bastards they are, and how bastardly  they have treated their families. Twenty bucks says this guy never spent 10 minutes around a Cluster-B and if he did no one offed themselves in front of them. Peep left a comment there that draws it to a salient conclusion telling us what we already know. Oppressors don't give a shit about us. My mother was the main dealer of misery in our house and we all just let her. My father's suicide left us all to scatter to the four winds..On some level he knew he was transferring his excess dysfunction on to the next generation. As did she. And neither of them gave a shit. In fact my father went out of his way so I could be there when he did it. My mother would have devoured this guy whole. And used his rib bones to pick her teeth. People need to stop asking the wrong question. In stead of asking why these atrocities happen, they should be asking why don't they happen more often. Most crazy people I have met only check their behavior if they think they are being watched.


Can we just call it what it is? And what it is is crazy. We will never understand why they do what they do. I am going to recycle some words my sister wrote to me that really sums it up. At least it works well as a map into the labyrinth of my parents minds.
What she wrote me was this.

 "I think they proved to the world they were wrong, it isn't just us seeing it.  Everyone who ever knew them
knows they were fucked up.  Maybe not the extent of it, but people aren't as dumb as they thought.
Pretty much for the world, any of the things they did tells the world they'd screwed up. Killing yourself
or other people, going on trial for killing people, disowning your own children over nothing, neglecting children, hating your own children, not having a funeral, or memorial because you're too stubborn, talking about your children like their dogs. Seriously, just running your own kids down to everyone is enough for most people to back away and go whoa, that's freaky". 

At my age it really doesn't make a shits worth of difference. She was crazy and then made him crazy too. He smothered her , she smothered him. I wish they had smothered their kids and been done with it. Or how  about only a crazy person picks such a horrific way to end it and then drags their son into the fray. Good riddance to them both. My ex think she really took us to the cleaners. Like she got the cherry off the shitty life we had growing up. This was just more of what we dealt with all our lives. We saw this coming from way off. You say tomato. I say tomahto. They are both dead and will remain that way for the foreseeable future. I only re-hash this shit so when my mind enters the lions cage I have a chair and a whip to fight it back.  And maybe, just maybe, someone will read this and learn something about man's inhumanity to man. And if not that. They might know they are not alone. There are families out there that get pretty fucked up by just one or two crazy members. 

20 comments:

Five Hundred Pound Peep said...

Thanks for writing about this Q.I agree, there is danger in considering the seared and wicked as all wounded souls. We already deal with a society that makes endless excuses for the most wicked,and millions suffer under their oppression.Playing they are just misunderstood and love will lead them back, is the surest way to be destroyed by them. I spend decades reaching out to my mother, thinking maybe there was a person inside that was hidden from me, what an imagination I had until I teared the veil down in my eyes and realized nobody was home and my tears, love, "forgiveness"and even anger mattered not to her and her focus was on getting her needs met in this life.

I believe suicide is actually rarer among malignant narcs and sociopaths, maybe some if they have lost everything in this life and all supply maybe that is the end of the road for them. I would have to let the psychologists answer that one, probably some do commit suicide who cannot bear the monsters they have become, but that would be those with a vestige of some conscience but where it is too limited to make amends or repent or admit they were wrong.[this does not apply to every suicide of course, it has multiple reasons and types of people doing it]

Yes the oppressors don't care. Michael Jackson did that song, "They don't care about us" and he is right. Socipathic prison guards don't cry about beating their prisoners, they do it because they love the power, and feeling of control, they love what they do. Our pity is wasted. Oppressors don't care. I had to face facts, my mother doesn't care if I live or die and neither did my father when he left me severely ill in that ghetto without a dime as he left my mother everything to squander. I look at that picture of myself standing next to him and Aunt Confused in 1997 and I am so ill seeing that picture shocks me now even compared to today's ill health that requires house call doctors. Some people who haven't dealt with Cluster Bs or had a covert or moderate narc to deal with, don't understand the full depth of evil, they are fortunate to have been spared, but the advice to imagine "feelings" in stone cold malignant narcissists, is a dangerous message. They don't care and we can't make them care. It's like Timothy Treadwell, remember the guy who got eaten by grizzly bears,who imagined them as his friends, and he had love and understanding and wanted to be CLOSE TO THEM.

Yes your mother did not care, mine did not care, neither of our fathers cared.

Thanks for sharing your sister's words,it sums up what you went through.

I wasted decades having pity for the evil and trying to "understand" them....and it was wasted energy.

q1605 said...

I left a comment on a thread of yours that I meant to put in this post. But couldn't find a way to wedge it in. I said if they didn't know their behavior was abhorrent they wouldn't lie about it. My mother went to her grave lying the whole way through. All it did was to give her enablers enough reasonable doubt to come steal from us and justify their actions by using her lies as an excuse. There was a point in time I thought my mother cared about me, but in the end it was all about knifing her family in the back one. more. time.

Judith said...

Yeah, all Hitler needed was to be loved and understood. I'm sure having people pity him would've saved the world from his evil.

Tundra Woman said...

It would have been a bit easier to get my head around if not for the reality their behavior was premeditated, targeted and intentional. It wasn't simply that they blew through our lives like an F5 tornado, but that as much as some behavior was simply reflexive, much more was planned. It's not a matter of a "few mistakes were made," it was the millions of different ways over the years we were reminded *we* were the "mistakes."
TW

q1605 said...

Yes Judith but think of his self esteem! If only someone had nurtured his wounded inner child.
I know TW! Just this Morning I thought about what I posted and how much of a one trick pony I have become. But really If you haven't lived it you can not get it. I am on a true crime television kick and in the end they interview the victim's families and they tell people they will never get over it. You hear none of the well worn platitudes you hear from people that were raised out side the bubble. One of the common themes of a survivor is how it reads like a work of fiction and how they wouldn't believe what they went through if they heard it from others. Their mother or father or sisters were usually as bad as my mother or worse. They seem to hang up on the premeditated way these people act. And they cannot grasp how a person they used to love tried to kill or rob them. And how dumb they eventually looked thinking they could just get away with it. I always wish that my mother would have gone to prison. But that would have just left us with our crazy father. What's worse when both of them are so crazy? We would have been shed of her, but he would have gone through with his plans to not have to live with out her. And here we were just a couple of kids with parents that were as nutty as it gets.

Anonymous said...

Hi there,
I am familiar with the pain of being caught off guard by the pre meditated planning and evil doings of narc parents. If you feel any pity or care for the MN's this is when they will really try to fuck you up. No remorse. Or if you are in a vulnerable situation. It's taken me a long ass time to get my mind around it. It's so wrong. They love traumatizing and wrecking us, and will stoop to wherever they have to to do it. When you are raised by narcs, and if you make it to adult hood, you are forever peeling the layers back, exposing atrocities. NC is the only way you can try to prevent new ones. But sometimes, as you know, they find ways to keep up the torture. MG

Anonymous said...

Yeah, I think about how my siblings and I were vulnerable when we were kids. It's just the nature of being a kid, and my parents were also nutty as hell I'm sorry you had to deal with your dad committing suicide. I have had a sibling that's on a dangerous path, behavior that's a by product of a narc parent up bringing. I keep trying to get through to her but have been mostly unsuccessful. I recently listened to the song by Chris Cornell and Layne Staley called Right turn. It reminds me of the feeling of being raised by the craziness...narc parents. It ain't right... I always wonder if suicide and self inflicted death with drugs and alcohol are related somehow to narcs and their gaslighting... I know it has to be.. I'm thinking of my siblings. " It's hard to believe somebody tricked you, so you gambled. Flat on your face, and into the fire" Right Turn. I keep on fighting MG

q1605 said...

Once you get old you just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other. The damage is done and we have to deal with whats left over.

Five Hundred Pound Peep said...

I wrote the blogger and told them you may be able to reach police and military still with consciences, but the rest forget it. Some enter a system and get corrupted but even those who had a conscience at the start and then lost it made their choice as well, but even those folks are different from those who pursue the sociopath malignant narc path of giving as much pain to others as possible. They lie and connive, these are confused people, who are trying to make it through the thicket of situational ethics, they are out to screw their fellow mankind over.

Love and understanding for sociopaths, just means they get away with more. :/

Yes they plot and plan what they do, TW they are not the confused trying to remove the veil of darkness from their faces, they are the darkness.

I think you would have been off with Momster in prison Q but that's neither here or there, maybe she would have pulled a Warren Jeffs or White Oleander crap anyway, and directed her robot enablers from the prison cell anyhow.

Pity,soft feelings, wanting to make things nice, "forgiveness" and trying to hug the cold statue, are all ways to get double screwed over with a sociopath in your midst, they take advantage of those human feelings. Mine used mine like puppet strings. When I became NC I had to depend on intellect to lead me and set aside feelings, feelings are only used against one with these people.

Tundra Woman said...

Maybe it's the arc of your own history, when you look back over decades of the same themes over and over again that the magnitude of their malignancy really sets in. I am grateful I got out around my mid to late 20s. That surfaced her crazy beyond any doubts. I knew she was a nasty piece of work but I didn't realize HOW nasty until NC. She was gonna show me, how dare I walk away after she abused me out the door just as she did to Dad and my full sister who she fought with in epic battles. I always figured my full sister would hang around because she's just as greedy as her mother and both were drama queen "victims."
TW

q1605 said...

I just don't know why they make it all so complicated. They make their life and everyone else's life an emotional Rube Goldberg level of emotional hell. My sister once told me of a guy talking to another guys mother that he had just met and she kept telling the one guy something and was mainly just hemming and hawing around it all and the woman's son just finally said," she wants you to do it for her." And when he offered it up she said Yes thank you. And he did and that was the end of the conversation. But we get then doing that on complicated emotional and complicated things.

q1605 said...

And another thing why and how do they choose to be an authority on matters they know nothing about. Do they throw a dart at a dart board with complex psychology issues written on it and see where it lands and check a couple of books out on that subject and read them and start a blog? That's like me starting a blog about sky diving when I would never jump out of a perfectly good airplane. Peep I am going to go back and look but what makes this guy so uniquely qualified to write about and give advice about this subject? I write about criminally insane parents because I am steeped in them, I don't remember him citing any examples that led me to believe he had a clue he knows what he is talking about. I can go check books out of a library and read them myself. I am off now to see what his deal is.

Five Hundred Pound Peep said...

When you review your life as an ACON, it can be scary, I am even peeling back layers, with that sociopath there are so many lies to work through, I am glad you got out earlier TW, my mid 40s was pretty late but better late then never and I warn against the LC path too. Yeah sounds like yours went into what they call an extinction burst, mine is more busy, showing off to "her friends" and I dare say in the four years I have been gone, basically just pretends I am not there and has told her inner circle of flying monkeys, I have gone "crazy" and "paranoid" and she "doesn't know what she did", the fact I never was believed is why I had to cut all of them off.

Even if Queen Spider kicks off, there's more then a few spiders still laying in wait. I realized Mini-Me while not as intelligent, definitely got the gaslighting part down.

We are dealing with another narc, so many entering our radar lately, it's scary. I've gotten nervous living here, thinking anyone who is nice to me and actually talks to me always seems to have an agenda, I met this woman at an art class who started talking about using my apartment pool via me--but she doesn't know I am too disabled to use it myself, it only has ladders, and she got giantly irritated when I told her, I can't take art classes in summer because I can't breathe outside. Should have kept the details more close to my vest. this other guy, was friendly and reminds me so much of the fake book agent, I told husband lets kind of bow out. I am getting to the point I don't want to talk to anyone anymore......:(

I think normal people who maybe have better incomes and more "acceptance" in society, do get in this mode of "wishful" thinking, thinking their narc experience was a one-off and a rarity and "all we need is love"? There's levels of narcs too, we had stone cold sociopaths.

I do wonder what his experience is, with narcissists, I wish I could remember. They do talk a lot about politics,but if your view of evil remains in false idealism, you won't even understand how politics really works.I don't agree with all the peak oil.I did meet them elsewhere online but don't know them personally--I was interested in some of the discussions of narcissism relative to Trump and American voters but usually they ignore my responses to blog posts, this was a new one where I got a response.

q1605 said...

Peep I went back and at least the guy has some links to other blogs that are highly entertaining.
http://www.actionsquad.org/ruins.html
I don't really trust any body anymore either. If one person tells a friend about seeing me out and they tell two friends and they tell two friends I might as well start a newsletter to let people in on what I have going on. I live so close to where I was born and at one point could hardly leave the house with out bumping into an old friend. I think I am being more paranoid than anything else. I don't think there are many people from the old school who give a shit one way or the other. Everyone has careers to maintain and grandchildren to raise. All the things I sacrificed to keep my mother at bay.

q1605 said...


Also Peep, I have developed a metaphorical switch in my brain I can flick on and off at will. This is a new tool for me and the more I use it, the better command I have over it. That is, when my thoughts turn to the horrific memories of the past I am learning how to shove out the flash backs and replace them with the thoughts of puppies and kittens. And then I think of how my mother would have tied fireworks to them and watched them run under a car and light it on fire.
Rome wasn't built in a day my dearest Peep. Rome wasn't built in a day.

q1605 said...

Ya know TW? They unwittingly train us to ultimately go NC. I can hear the voice inside my mothers head telling her to let them/us start over with nothing. That will show them. But she had been doing that to us all our lives. Every affair she had with a guy that prompted our father to move across town, all the way down to her murder trial, all made us start all over again. At least with her estate I had my own money and didn't have to depend on two of the most psychotic fuckers in North Texas.

Five Hundred Pound Peep said...

Yeah he's got some interesting blogs on here. Thanks for understanding me not trusting people anymore, I've been burned so badly the last few years, I know I am being extra-cautious. Yeah, I don't think you are paranoid. Not enough people know me here, a few down at one church I go to charity meals at may notice my existence, but I am kind ofa ghost and an enigma to most. I'd be dead meat in Queen Spiders town though, so feel for you to be living close to where you were born. I was moved around and moved around so much, I can't even tell people exactly where I am from. I use the small town I lived in for almost 10 years as the proxy "hometown" [lived there during my 30s] but living in a town that had relatives even long ago dead ones in it, who would have laid some smear campaign eggs, that would be tough. They probably are busy with their lives, but I understand those feelings.

Five Hundred Pound Peep said...

Q, I am compartmentalizing a bit, I allow myself some discussion and thought on the blog--I am even considering posting about the "I am downsizing" narc show off email and acouple support boards, but in real life, I am doing the "Don't think about them anymore" exercises and shutting down the thoughts.

I am far less tortured then I used to be as time has passed by. I am allowing myself escape into some hobbies, books and TV shows like never missing an episode of Better Call Saul. I had some memories return, in my early years of NC, so I had to wade through that muck, which isn't to say some new stuff couldn't crop up. I seem to have had a major cure for severe anxiety disorders though I am not sure how much of that is having a COPD medicine that actually works [I am still housebound] but can breathe better then I did for years. Yeah, with the flashbacks, one does have to work to shut that stuff off, I do. I still have some of the worse stuff decades in age, cropping up too.

That said even when I do shut off some of the thoughts for my own good,I also am ofthe mind now to think and say whatever I want to. I had enough of the narcs trying to police that on me long enough. It's true all this will take time. I'm doing better knowing I can't fix any of it, and I didn't choose it, they did.


Yeah they with going NC, definitely. Mine were slowly cutting me off more year by year, with just enough contact to keep tabs on me and nothing more. Now all access to information is gone. Yeah your mother ruined all stable life for you. My mother made me invisible from day one, now I'm gone poof like a ghost. What else did she expect.

q1605 said...

I think the fact that we agonize over the decision to go NC for years after the fact, is a great testament to the humanity we have and speaks volumes about how we will allow them into our heads over and over hoping that this time it will work out all right. But instead of them meeting us in the middle we continue to hear from them how it's my way or the hi-way while they slap us back in our place.

q1605 said...

And to augment my sisters words royally fucking us over for confronting her with the truth.